SB Tournament: A History of Effort

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SB Tournament: A History of Effort; and Nonsense
Tweet Topic Started: May 29 2014, 02:25 PM (289 Views)
Lord Talancir D'Landior	May 29 2014, 02:25 PM Post #1
~ RP Knight ~ Posts: 2,394 Group: Former Monarchs Member #2,592 Joined: September 26, 2007 Gender: Male Game Currently Playing: All the games. All of it.	Greetings to all who read this. This is the “in-progress” paper written on behalf of all those who wish to plan for a tournament. By reading about the Tournaments of yore, you may have a good idea of what to do and what to avoid. May the Tournaments of tomorrow be successful. While I’m the OP of the thread, any comments, edits, and things to add would be much appreciated. Thank you in advance. ~Talancir Overall Issues to address: Attendance / Interest Complexity Tourney Organizer Presence? Length (Duration) Positives / Negatives SB Tournament History: SB Tourney 1 - “Shrouded in myth and legend.” Recessed into the depths of Sonic Blast itself. - Tournament Reported as Completed, courtesy of Blaire Fields. This tournament was before I’d even created an account here on Sonic Blast. I don’t know who was running it, or who participated in it. I don’t even know how far back I need to browse through the archives to find all of the associated threads. You can at least find the bracket thread here.All I’ve heard is that the tournament completed successfully, PCs fought (and a few died, scandalously!), and there was enough interest for a second tournament. I would assume that this tournament was a single elimination style, which is the easiest format that anyone can accomplish. Any shortcomings encountered at this time is unknown, but I do recall that it was because of Tournament 1 that PC deaths became highly frowned upon. Or I could be remembering it wrong, I dunno. The length thereof is also unknown. A high positive included the exercise of “RP under duress,” as I’ve come to consider it. Players must be able to RP successfully against their opponent, owing to their characters’ skillset and the players’ ability to adapt to changing circumstances, and the abilities of their opponent. It’s very safe to say that the first tournament became the model upon which all successive tournaments were based. The first tournament also has the distinction of having the best format for the tournaments that followed. OCs were not allowed, due to various RP issues, and so the Tournament became a showcase of PC characters and their abilities. It would seem that the standard length of the first tournament was one week per match. Later iterations would double the amount of time allotted per match. SB Tourney 2 - Single Elimination, Tag Team Tournament. Hosted by Spin, MoD, DragonFlame - Tournament Incomplete (Stalled at the Finals) I was able to participate in this event. The format involved the combatants splitting up into teams of two, and facing off against each other. As I recall, only one member from each team could be in the arena at a time, and each team member had a set amount of posts before their partner switched in. Each match was also restricted to a maximum of twenty posts, so that left 5 posts to fight your opponent, and the Latest Settler required a mention of you ‘switching out’ for your partner. This tournament actually did not complete. It was left hanging during the finals. My partner and my opponent Bowie’s partner failed to materialize, along with other unclear matters. We declared ourselves joint winners and the tournament was concluded, without fanfare. A major problem surfaced here with players signing up, then failing to stick around until their part in the tournament was done. Several matches stalled and had to be decided by the judge / overseers of the tournament. Set times for the matches could indicate that players were known to have disappeared during the course of the first tournament. An obvious setback was a lack of participation; with the overall performance of the teams depending on the performance of the team members, when one or both team members left, their opponents were left hanging. A prompt ending to the matches, regardless of where the opponents stood at the time, became necessary to move the tournament along. I don’t remember any further hindrances. SB Tourney 3 - Single Elimination Tournament: Hosted by Vinny, Bowie, and TUC. - Tournament Completed By now, the tournaments have followed along the same proven format, however this time, there was a storyline involved. SB Tourney 4 - Round Robin Tournament. Hosted by Talancir D’Landior, Blizshadow…(don’t remember)? - Tournament Incomplete A grand experiment with an even more colossal failure. Lesson learned: when the mastermind drops off the face of the planet, the entire tournament suffers. Also, the tournament was too damn complex. I had envisioned a Round Robin tournament in which everyone got to fight each other, with a bonus rounds for those who didn’t have an opponent to face during each new sequence. It didn’t occur to me until the tournament was going on, just how intensive and how grueling the tournament would be. I imagine that after my absence, the tournament mercifully ground to a halt. The original idea was that everyone would fight each other once, and once that happened, those who scored low (say, the bottom 50%) would be eliminated. There would then be another sequence of Round Robin matches, followed by another elimination, until there was an eventual Finals Match to determine the winner. Twenty / twenty hindsight says to me that in order to have a round robin tournament move along at a decent pace, there needs to be a very small list of participants, say 8 or less. It also relies on there being an even number of participants in order for people to avoid having a round where they didn’t have an opponent (resulting in a bye). Ultimately, however, I wouldn’t recommend doing this again, as this requires a high degree of coordination, enthusiasm and participation from all parties involved. SB Tourney 5 - Single Elimination Tournament. Hosted by L Dragon, Pheonix-Saturn, CyFox, DragonFlame - Tournament Incomplete Seems to have suffered from the same failure mode as Tourney 4: Without guidance from the organizer (or whoever holds the creative reins), the entire project falls apart. - I’d “fallen off the planet” at this point, but it was reported to me that the overall complexity was a lot worse than the previous tournament. I heard that the whole “L Duality Incident” didn’t help matters. SB Tourney 6 - Double Elimination Tournament. Hosted by Talancir D’Landior, DragonFlame - Tournament Completed An effort was made to decentralize the creative process by giving the competitors a chance to judge their peers, and by making a list of arenas that the competitors can choose to fight in. It’s worked surprisingly well, and the Tournament completed entirely. Instead of relying on the Organizers themselves to start the threads, one of the two opponents would instead start the thread in which the match would be contained. The system was deliberately simple: I’d have the opponents pick a number between one and ten. The winner would choose an arena out of the available options, and their opponent would start the thread. It was still left to myself and DF to create a list of arenas for the opponents to choose from. An attempt at a bonus match stalled due to IRL issues, and was decided (with Ludi, the champion of the 6th Tournament) to be left at an ambiguous end for the purposes of closing the event. I acknowledge a failure of time management and an increase of homework on my part. The bonus round had no bearing on who was to be the final winner of the tournament, so it was left at that. Overall, a formula for a successful tournament must rely on the ability to run on its own with minimal steering from the organizers. The way this was done in tournament six was to let the participants grade each other. It was best to let one side of the match tree to grade the other. Obviously, abuse can arise if you let people who are expected to battle the winner of a judgement to judge the match. Diversion of interests and focuses are a given in this; IRL will always trump hobbies, free time, etc. If the organizers suffer from this, then the tournament will suffer, especially if the tournament relies heavily on direction and input from the organizers. I feel that the more the tournament can be run through decentralized organization, the more likely the tournament on a whole will succeed. Edited by Talancir D'Landior, May 30 2014, 10:30 AM.
	RP Aid: So, you want to be a storyteller? A must read for any Storyteller who wants to be better at his craft. RP Aid: Combat: A Comprehensive Guide to Beating Arse By the way, I'm on skype. Search for talancir. Millstone of Time Resources My Character Archive: http://sonicblast.org/topic/7265216 Please, feel free to enter and comment at will. I crave discussion Magick Formula Overview Concepts


Sharizard	May 29 2014, 06:23 PM Post #2
Angel Island Act 1 Posts: 43 Group: E+ Rank Adventurer Member #13,883 Joined: April 1, 2014 Gender: Undisclosed	The first tournament. For the curious it's on the last few pages of the Advanced Garden. It was literally the first place I checked.



Lord Talancir D'Landior	May 29 2014, 06:57 PM Post #3
~ RP Knight ~ Posts: 2,394 Group: Former Monarchs Member #2,592 Joined: September 26, 2007 Gender: Male Game Currently Playing: All the games. All of it.	OP edited with a link to the Tourney 1 brackets thread.
	RP Aid: So, you want to be a storyteller? A must read for any Storyteller who wants to be better at his craft. RP Aid: Combat: A Comprehensive Guide to Beating Arse By the way, I'm on skype. Search for talancir. Millstone of Time Resources My Character Archive: http://sonicblast.org/topic/7265216 Please, feel free to enter and comment at will. I crave discussion Magick Formula Overview Concepts


Ludichaos	May 29 2014, 11:39 PM Post #4
[Outrealm Vagabond] Posts: 4,994 Group: C Rank Legend Member #11,272 Joined: July 25, 2010	From memory the problem with Tournament 5 wasn't the complexity of its set up, but the complexity of the story that accompanied it. It just wound up being pulled in so many weird directions out of nowhere that it became a little hard to really know what was going on anymore. I believe that in turn lead to people losing interest. The 'duality incident' proved to be the final straw. Also, minor error in relation to Tournament 6's operations: The winner didn't start the thread. The winner was given the choice out of any available arena they wanted, while the loser started up the thread once the decision was made. This basically gave the winning player the chance to choose an arena that best suited their character for an advantage. Gone ahead and corrected that for you, since you said edits were fine~ All in all an organiser should at least be sure they can check in on a torunament every once in a while to clarify any issues or inquries that may arise from participants. Back-up overseers definitely help in that regard. So long as you can set up a solid framework that the players can use to keep things moving on their own, it's usually fine. Which is why I recommend going with as minimal a plot as possible if you can't maintain it for the duration. Otherwise you've got a bunch of players wondering what happens next and no author to tell them. Tournament style should definitely be determined by interest. If you have a small number of participants, a Round Robin may actually be ideal! But more often than not the tried and true elimination style is best. Just play it by ear and use your best judgement.
	【One third of Sonic Blast's Legendary Australian Trio. The last remaining member 】


Lord Talancir D'Landior	May 30 2014, 10:32 AM Post #5
~ RP Knight ~ Posts: 2,394 Group: Former Monarchs Member #2,592 Joined: September 26, 2007 Gender: Male Game Currently Playing: All the games. All of it.	Thanks for the edits, Ludi. also, I took a quick glance at the bracket thread and looked at the 3rd Place Fight; there was only a week's time per match to get your posts in. If this was the standard, then I for one am grateful that the match length was doubled in later tournaments.
	RP Aid: So, you want to be a storyteller? A must read for any Storyteller who wants to be better at his craft. RP Aid: Combat: A Comprehensive Guide to Beating Arse By the way, I'm on skype. Search for talancir. Millstone of Time Resources My Character Archive: http://sonicblast.org/topic/7265216 Please, feel free to enter and comment at will. I crave discussion Magick Formula Overview Concepts


Ludichaos	May 31 2014, 05:50 AM Post #6
[Outrealm Vagabond] Posts: 4,994 Group: C Rank Legend Member #11,272 Joined: July 25, 2010	Yeah, I would have struggled with that time limit as well. I usually only get one or two posts in a day maximum thanks to my time zone being at odds with everyone elses. So my matches usually go slow. But leave it too long and you get unfinished tournaments. Bit of a slippery slope, I guess.
	【One third of Sonic Blast's Legendary Australian Trio. The last remaining member 】


Sharizard	May 31 2014, 06:00 PM Post #7
Angel Island Act 1 Posts: 43 Group: E+ Rank Adventurer Member #13,883 Joined: April 1, 2014 Gender: Undisclosed	Participation will always be what it is. I've seen quite a few of these things happen and I can honestly say that you're lucky if half your players even post in the first round. It's the nature of the beast; no matter how much effort you put into it(or don't put into it) your players can and will disappear at the drop of a hat. Focus on keeping the ones who you know are going to stick around entertained rather than trying to herd a bunch of stray cats. If they're serious about roleplaying and didn't just show up to save face they'll get themselves involved. The sixth tournament looks like it went very well by those standards. But considering how some of the other tournaments went I'd say you were lucky; both that your players were so motivated and that there wasn't any interference from real life or otherwise. Granted that I didn't participate in any of them, but that's just my opinion. Personally I always advocate the inclusion of a storyline in fights. There will always be players who can and will keep themselves motivated but showing up just to hit each other in the face gets boring and people can easily accomplish that without a tournament. Even tournaments where everyone is motivated at the start can peter out in the finals because the players are exhausted from posting constantly. It doesn't have to be terribly complicated but even some basic structure can make things a lot more dramatic(and interesting) for the people involved. It might not seem that way but there is more to a tournament than just getting two characters to wail on one another, capitalize on it. Along that line of though I'd say always stick to single elimination. A loser's bracket is a good way to give people who still want to play a reason to stick around but double elimination and round robin go against dramatic convenience. Comebacks sound good on paper but the longer you keep the tournament around the more chance there is your players will drop off and the whole effort will look shoddy for it. If they want to fight more then that just gives them a reason to come back later. As far as time limits go? At a glance the posts in the first tournament look way shorter than the other ones. Not saying that the fights weren't good, they could have been amazing, but considering that everyone was younger and it was the first one the bar of quality was probably set lower too. The older people get the more inclined they are to be long winded in their posts or busy/lazy with their real lives. Depending on how interested(and quick) your players are two weeks to a month is a good limit for a round. If you need to inject your players with a sense of brevity than you can have time based penalties if they take too long. The one I mentioned before was the critical hit, take too long to respond to an active attack and it automatically lands. Course, that's just me. Edited by Sharizard, May 31 2014, 06:04 PM.



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