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- North Korea: Opinions on What's Gonna Happen?
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| North Korea: Opinions on What's Gonna Happen? | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Feb 23 2013, 06:09 AM (473 Views) | |
| BLOPS2 | Feb 23 2013, 06:09 AM Post #1 |
Walkers, Walkers everywhere
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http://worldnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/02/19/17016501-north-korea-threatens-final-destruction-of-south-korea-in-un-debate?lite In case you don't know what's going on here, they aired this a while ago: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9FbmmsDYObU |
| Gonna dropkick it. | |
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| VlaDDrakkeN | Apr 23 2013, 12:52 PM Post #46 |
The Jester
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Its hard for me to pick a side on the atomic bombs of Hiroshima and Nagasaki thing. While the alternative, a land invasion, would no doubt lead to utter massacres and possibly even near genocide, that doesn't detract away from the fact the bombs were used on civilian targets, and it was more likely to intimidate the Soviets than anything. When you consider the political efforts of the west and US has made in the past 100-200 years in the Pacific, its hard to imagine that they did so purely for noble reasons. WW2 was really Imperial Powers A vs Imperial Powers B, much like WW1 and I am often hazy on calling the Allies the "Good guys." I personally fear that at this point, we may soon either be in Iran or North Korea if things continue and considering Ive heard that we maybe on route to a finanical collapse much like or even worse than the one we experienced in 2008, I doubt we could survive another war. |
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| YamiShadow | Apr 23 2013, 01:01 PM Post #47 |
Flying Battery Act 1
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Although it may be possible to say that the intentions of the Allies weren't exactly noble, I don't understand your difficulty in saying which side is favourable. Fascism is hideous; the holocaust, monstrous. Capitalism, while perhaps abuse-able, is easily a less hideous option than Fascism, so if we're going to consider this in terms of ideals (Which I think is necessary, considering the fact that those who won would enforce their ideals) it's pretty easy to see which side is favourable. |
 Thanks again to Parabola for the awesome signature! 
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| VlaDDrakkeN | Apr 23 2013, 01:43 PM Post #48 |
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The Jester
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Well, when you consider that fascism, while is a reaction to communisms rise, you have to also realize the Allies kinda did it to themselves. Japan largely was the result of westernization, mostly cause they were threatened by the western powers(Which was a justifiable fear when you consider the Opium Wars and India being overtaken by the British), and Germany was screwed over ten times over to pay for a war that they did not start. Point is, the allies may of been favorable to the fascists, but really, deep down they have fascism in them too. The UK for one mostly saw itself above other peoples, characterzing Africans as third class citizens, and Indians as second class. Than there is the attempts at cultural genocide(Which was done by other European powers and the US to a extent), and well we can go on and on about that, and the USSR(Which has its own colorful history, much thanks to Stalin) was only a ally cause of a common ally, cause really everyone, even the allies, hated the Soviets for being everything that anti-capitalism and the feeling was mutual. The US also has a long history of imperialism in its own regard. You know Pearl Harbor, that was bombed? Yeah, Hawaii wasen't a state at the time, it was a territory, a territory that was gained because of a revolt by buisness men that we sided with. Do you really think the Japanese would at all think of us as a problem if we were not equally entwined in the Pacific? Of course some would point out that had we not, than the Japanese would of been awful...but than again, so would the UK and other colonial powers, and we can get into a long heated thing that ends up reminding me why my darkened view of humanity constantly keeps budding up. In a way, both world wars were a inevitabilty created by ourselves by our long history of conflict and blaming just one thing or another does not take into the account of everything that is to be taken acount of. It is why I shake my head whenever people blame religion for 9/11. If you know your history, you can trace it back to the Afghanistan War and how we played a part in it. And if you go further back, you take the invovlement we have made in the Middle East and the enemies and "allies" we made. Even further, you have the Western powers making claims and taking territories. When yous tart do this, you realize that religion being only a factor, with much of the blame being on other various factors ranging from economy to ambitions of power. When you go into the history of things, you really start to realize that what has happened was not a random event, but a event created by other events of the past. If the Fascists didn't rise, or if Japan did not become a Imperial power, than it wouldn't be suprising if we were at Europes throat for power in the Pacific, or be locked in a cold war with the Soviets even earlier. Its why I have this view, cause in the end, all politics today is the result of politics in the past and why we are still at risk even today, cause we haven't really changed a whole lot and that will result in contiueing the pattern we are following. So we either stop antgonizing peoples, races, religions, or we continue down our road of self destruction. Not to mention this is horribly off topic, but, again, the situation we face now is a situation created by our past and knowing our past is how we know why things are as they are now. That is why we learn history, and why I have severe doubts for humanity when we seem content with not giving it any credit to its importance. Edited by VlaDDrakkeN, Apr 23 2013, 01:47 PM.
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| YamiShadow | Apr 23 2013, 02:13 PM Post #49 |
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Flying Battery Act 1
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I acknowledge what you've said regarding westernization in Asia, Japan in particular, but only to an extent. The majority of the westernization that happened in Japan was actually after World War II. It was, in essence, the results of their loss. China, on the other hand, suffered from a lot more westernization before the World Wars. Japan's efforts to spread power had little to do with westernization and a lot to do with their desire for conquest; one need only look at their history to know that they actually had tried to take over China and Korea in a very similar fashion to the way that did it in WWII at least twice if not three times. They failed simply because of extreme storms stopping their ships. Japan's attempt to spread was the desire for conquest, nothing more and nothing less. As for genocide attempts... Perhaps. But, I would make a distinction between a country 'once supporting' something and 'now supporting' something. The US and most of Europe had clearly learned their lesson by the time of WWII in regards to racism-- at least on a national level; there is always going to be racists in every country, as that's an issue that's near impossible to deal with-- while in contrast fascism directly promoted racial dominance. So, yes, the other nations involved do have tainted histories. But there's a huge difference from having a tainted history (crimes committed by hands that came before your own) and causing racial genocide firsthand while also promoting it. And yes, the US most certainly does have a long history of imperialism. Glancing at a map won't tell you this, but if you start reading the text next to small islands, the US is actually all across most of the world even now. Japan attacked the US because it wanted to spread conquest to the east of its lands as well as the west. All you've basically said here is that conquest requires the expanding of national boundaries, which I grant is true. To be fair, religion is indeed involved in 9/11. The people behind the attack were indeed religious extremists. Religion itself isn't the problem, but when people take it to an extreme-- particularly for the purposes of violence, but even otherwise-- there is in fact an issue. But yes, you're right. The troubles that the US are having with the Middle East are because they can't stop meddling with issues in the Middle East. But, at the same time, it isn't exclusively western powers who do this. Anywhere in the world-- at any point in history-- you will find people seeking conquest. China and Japan have the history to prove it, as does the Middle East. I am absolutely certain that if I were more well-versed on the history of the Americas prior to the arrival of Europeans, it would be the same case there too. Nor is Africa an exception. This is a fact regarding the entire world. "If"s don't change what is, so I see no real point in thinking about how history might have played out differently, for the purposes of this debate. Nor does it change the fact that Capitalism is the better alternative to both Fascism and Communism, which honestly are both just a guise dictatorship ad best and tyranny at worst. But yes, you're right. This is fairly off-topic. I've got an essay to work on anyways. xD; |
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Thanks again to Parabola for the awesome signature!
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| SuperTails | Apr 24 2013, 03:38 AM Post #50 |
Angel Island Act 1
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They are not Thinking now are they? |
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Kitm
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Apr 24 2013, 10:17 AM Post #51 |
Lava Reef Act 1
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Please do not bump old topics unless ypu have something substantiative to add. Just a reminder. Thanks. ^^ Anyways, merging the two North Korea topics. |
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| Smashmaster | Apr 24 2013, 11:17 AM Post #52 |
Carnival Night Act 1
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Well that was kinda what I was trying to say, I wish it could have been avoidable. But the origional part of my statement was North Korea should take the hint and buy a clue. Attacking us = bad idea. What bolded line do you mean? It goes with my sig...which I can't see...can anyone else see it? Why did the Chicken cross the road? Spoiler: click to toggle And what does it mean to 'bump' a topic? |
 I will find you...and I will have you post in an RP... | |
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| Amarok | Apr 24 2013, 12:41 PM Post #53 |
Fear the cold...
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Two things: One. To bump a topic is to post in what was previously an ignored topic. Mr. SuperTails here had posted in an old topic with little to add to it, and the mod had moved the post here Two. We all know that this would be a terrible venture for North Korea. What the real question should be is "What is America going to do about it?" Obviously, it's not the best idea to start a war, even if they're asking for it. The smart thing to do is to figure out how to end the crisis with the least damage possible. But how? |
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