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| Super Forms; Question/rant/theory thread | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: May 31 2011, 02:39 AM (1,082 Views) | |
| Needless Nyx | May 31 2011, 02:39 AM Post #1 |
Hydrocity Act 1
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So.... I was laying in bed at 5 am thinking randomly and unable to sleep and suddenly I got this weird thought. I began remembering about Sonic's super form from the Archie comics. I remembered that in the comics Sonic's super form was some sort of evil split personality/entity form that would kill mercilessly and Sonic eventually had to defeat and cast away into some dimension (or so I remember reading, I never actually read the comics) Anyway after that I thought about the game version of Super Sonic and how it reminded me of DBZ more than anything. Thus a bunch of thoughts sprouted in my brain about the Super forms of Hedgehogs and the Chaos Emeralds in general.... Rant- So remember when in the classic Sonic games where you had to go through a lengthy process to even GET Super form? That seemed the change in the modern Sonic games when it sorta turned into a DBZ rip-off. Next thing you knew in basically every Sonic game Sonic got some Super form, as well would Shadow and even Silver in 06. It felt weird as the hedgehogs were basically the Saiyan race of the Sonic universe at this point. Then it got me thinking why can't Amy turn super form? I mean I think she got in contact with the emeralds at least ONCE in the games. And being a hedgehog wouldn't she be able to manipulate the Chaos energy too? I dunno I felt that as strange that she never did.... Other than that I'm confused that the Chaos Emeralds have no negative effects on Sonic or Shadow or anyone really. I mean with the name CHAOS Emeralds you'd think they'd be dangerous? I might be thinking more like a DBZ fan, but wouldn't using the emeralds too much like store up negative energy much like the fake emeralds did in Sonic X? In the Archie comics (correct me if I'm wrong) wasn't the reason Sonic went insane when using super form was BECAUSE of the emeralds power? I know it's not canon but it would be interesting once or twice if Sonic couldn't control his super form in the game. I know that Archie super Sonic is completely different from Game/Modern/current Super Sonic but still... Or this could be my mind being random at 6:30 in the morning. I don't even know if half of what I'm spouting is even correct...  /hides. [/end rant] Soooo any theories or rants about the Super Forms? Dislikes for how OMG hax they seem now? Or how they are triggered in every game as a story mechanic? I'm just curious on what others think and so I few less like an angry nerd... So I guess debate away? Edited by Needless Nyx, May 31 2011, 02:40 AM.
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 WATASHI WA SHINEN! SHINEN ZUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU!-F-Zero I'M STILL IN A DREAM SNAKE EATERRRRRRRRRR!-MGS3 Needless Nyx lover of: Harvest Moon Franchise, Persona Franchise, DMC Franchise, Kingdom Hearts series, Cowboy Bebop, D.Grayman, Aoi no Exorcist, KHR, AND MANY MORE! | |
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| Deranged Crusader | May 31 2011, 02:54 AM Post #2 |
This is a delicate proced -- Oops
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Nitpick:: I thought the evil Super Sonic was from the Fleetway comic, but I could be wrong *shrug* Now that you mention it, it would be neat to see the Chaos Emerald transformation as being, well, Chaotic. I suppose it's a matter of game play -- Super Sonic was originally a bonus that eventually became a core bit of game play for a few games, and the continuities are separate, so maybe they really just don't really care much about explaining it? (Great now I'm rambling) As for Amy -- Ooh, I dunno. Every other hedgehog we've seen so far has been able to go super, so I would suppose she could, unless it's some kind of gender thing, though I don't think so. She just hasn't had contact with all seven at once. The story didn't demand it, I suppose. |
 
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| 742 mph | May 31 2011, 03:16 AM Post #3 |
Strange, isn't it?
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Here's the thing: Sonic, Shadow, and the others are on the good side, so they can really only use the positive energy of the Emeralds. The negative energy of the Emeralds has actually been used plenty of times (The Death Egg, Perfect Chaos, the Biolizard, Metal Overlord, Devil Doom, Solaris, Perfect Dark Gaia, etc.), maybe a little more than the positive energy in total. So yes, the Emeralds can be used for good or for evil, but the positive and negative energy they contain is seperate, so the user can choose which type of energy they want to absorb. Also, hedgehogs are not the only ones who can go super. Tails and Knuckles did it once (S3&K) and Blaze did it twice (Rush and Rush Adventure.) From what we've seen, it seems like there are less restrictions on who can use the negative energy, since everyone from the God of Destruction to the other God of Destruction to the other OTHER God of Destruction... wait, never mind. However, in all seriousness, it seems like the negative energy is much easier for non-Mobians to use. I can't say much on the subject of super-forms being DBZ ripoffs, but from what I do know about DBZ, even though super-forms appear as much as once per game in Sonic, they appear much more in DBZ (about five times per story segment.) Sonic super-forms are still nowhere near as common as those in DBZ. As for Amy never going Super, I don't remember any time when she would have wanted/needed to, so I bet there just hasn't been a scenario like that yet. Edited by 742 mph, May 31 2011, 03:19 AM.
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Reverse--Force--Blast--Circuit--Hax--Shadon--Kilo--Metal Super "98% of teens would be dead if Twilight said breathing wasn't cool. Put this in your signature if you are part of the 2% laughing." - Started by: Chrono the Demonic Crusader | |
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| FiniteZero | May 31 2011, 06:49 AM Post #4 |
Good vibes.
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I once thought about what it would be like if Amy went super. For some reason, I kept imagining her hammer would be replaced by a rather large axe. |
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| Telnaior | May 31 2011, 07:37 AM Post #5 |
Flying Battery Act 1
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Actually, just something completely random: I remember reading somewhere that Knux uses the negative energy of the emeralds to transform. |
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| Phoenix-Saturn | May 31 2011, 07:39 AM Post #6 |
i just wwant to be beautiful for this one month
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Never heard of that one. Might be comic canon. Also, Sonic (against his will, obviously) used a mixture of Dark Gaia's energy and the negative energy of the Chaos Emeralds to become a Werehog. |
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i'm actually really sorry bout this unfashionably late as alwways          I... Am... THE WEREHOG SUPPORTER! MUHAHAHAHA! *Howl* | |
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| Zak | May 31 2011, 07:56 AM Post #7 |
For The Circle
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Well as has been stated, there is negative chaos energy and positive energy, at least in the games. Positive chaos energy can very depending on it's source, for instance the chaos emeralds turn sonic super, and the sol emeralds turn blaze burning. The negative energy can turn sonic into forms like the werehog and darkspine sonic. I guess, hypothetically, anyone with a will strong enough can attain a super form, though it may be only the mobian race. So Amy could hypothetically turn super, I think it's just her lack of will to do so that's stopped her. Amy can defend herself fine, but lets face it, she hasn't fully recovered from her damsel in distress phase. Plus, her lack of experience with chaos energy might make her a very weak super, or one that runs out very quickly. Best to leave it to the heroes who know what they're doing. I think the energy itself is not necessarily chaotic, it just has that name. The name probably comes from Chaos, who was dubbed the god of destruction because of his massacre of the Knuckles tribe. Chaos at heart wasn't very chaotic, just an innocent chao, though a bit peeved. Since the energy was used by Chaos, it was called Chaos energy, and the Chaos emeralds. Whether or not the energy itself actually is unstable is probably a coincidence. |
| "Ati Ramar, In defeat we learn." | |
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| Phoenix-Saturn | May 31 2011, 08:33 AM Post #8 |
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i just wwant to be beautiful for this one month
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Darkspine was from the World Rings. The way I see it, The Chaos Emeralds have much more stable energy than the World Rings. Why? Well, to me, the Chaos Emeralds have reserves of both positive and negative energy, different types being used by different people/beings. They are neutral and impartial energy sources able to be used by anyone for any purpose. The World Rings, on the other hand, are emotion-based energy sources that require either extreme emotional states to acivate, or require the sacrifice of their collector. When they're activated without sacrifice... Bad things happen. (Ali-Layla Wa Layla was a failed attempt at Erazor Djinn trying to become a god. Three rings detached from him as he was fusing with them becuase Sonic had more unfiltered emotions corresponding to them) Also, In the games, no one is ever really affected by just picking up a Chaos Emerald, wheras the World Rings were painful for Sonic to touch. So, IMO, Chaos Energy = Stable, World Ring Energy = Unstable. In the case of Amy not being able to transform, I just think she doesn't transform becuase she doesn't want to/Doesn't have a reason to. I personally believe anyone could use the Chaos Emeralds to go Super. |
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i'm actually really sorry bout this unfashionably late as alwways I... Am... THE WEREHOG SUPPORTER! MUHAHAHAHA! *Howl* | |
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| Zak | May 31 2011, 09:12 AM Post #9 |
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For The Circle
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I had always thought that the Chaos Emeralds/Sol Emeralds/World rings all used the same type of energy, unless that color combination is just a string of coincidences. |
| "Ati Ramar, In defeat we learn." | |
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| Phoenix-Saturn | May 31 2011, 11:19 AM Post #10 |
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i just wwant to be beautiful for this one month
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Chaos and Sol, maybe. But the World Rings are, I'm pretty sure, quite different, since they're essentially concentrated emotional powers. |
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i'm actually really sorry bout this unfashionably late as alwways I... Am... THE WEREHOG SUPPORTER! MUHAHAHAHA! *Howl* | |
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| SuperShadowgal | May 31 2011, 04:40 PM Post #11 |
The Female Ultimate Life Form!
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As for the aptitude of becoming super or not, I just always imagined that it required a certain something. I dunno how to put it. Maybe learning math or riding a bike? I imagine all beings have the possibility to tap into Chaotic Energies, some just latch onto and learn easier than others. Take for example, using Chaos Control and the related. In SA2:B -- granted this is most likely for the sake of multiplayer being fair, but everyone, even Amy, is able to use a form of Chaos Control (with their own little flairs). Sonic, as another example, is able to use artificially made emeralds to Chaos Control -- something that Shadow admires in a sense. Sonic learned Chaos Control from Shadow. The ability was there, it just needed to develop. [[And the fact that Sonic used a fake emerald is saying something.]] When it comes to Super forms, we see that Sonic can turn Super and Hyper, Knuckles can turn Super and Hyper, Shadow can Super, Blaze can turn Super, the list goes on and on. But an interesting thing happens when you look at Tails. Tails cannot turn super using normal emeralds, he only goes super when exposed to the next tier (that being Super emeralds). We also see that a robot Sonic goes super (or maybe its hyper) by using the Master Emerald. And we also see that all super forms are different. Tails has flickies, Knuckles only glows pink/white, Shadow is a creamy yellow/silver. Etc. There are also speculations, regarding Silver and Blaze, that they can only use their respective emeralds (Sol), but I haven't played any of the games on console that feature them, so this could just be a lot of fanon. But all this rambling aside, back to whether Amy possesses the ability to turn super or not, it is quite possible. Maybe she cannot go super unless she has the Super Emeralds? Maybe she is able to and just doesn't know it yet. Maybe she is able but just doesn't know how. I also like to note some of the games today still feature gathering the emeralds, which unlocks the final story. Most of the time when it isn't I would just assume that they gathered the emeralds at some point by the time they got to Eggman. The emeralds do scatter after granting wishes and I would imagine a lot of the time spent between adventures involves finding them or at least keeping most out of Eggman's hands. |
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| Phoenix-Saturn | May 31 2011, 06:54 PM Post #12 |
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i just wwant to be beautiful for this one month
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Well, if we're going by 06 as canon, then Blaze definitely can use Chaos energy; she uses it to seal Iblis inside herself. |
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i'm actually really sorry bout this unfashionably late as alwways I... Am... THE WEREHOG SUPPORTER! MUHAHAHAHA! *Howl* | |
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| Captain Olimar | Jun 1 2011, 06:00 AM Post #13 |
Mushroom Hill Act 2
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I'd like to see a sonic game use them sort of like Sonic Heroes did. You had to get the keys and beat a hidden level to get an emerald. Get all seven and you unlock the final part of story mode, in which they become a plot item. I just wish that after that, you could become super during normal gameplay. |
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| Breezy | Jun 1 2011, 10:21 AM Post #14 |
We all make choices. But in the end, our choices make us
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Ive had these kind of thoughts myself about the all the super forms and the chaos emeralds. My very first Sonic game being SA2, I was used to just getting super form ever so simply. But once I played the older games it was very different having to work for that super form by collecting the emeralds. I feel that it would be better sticking to it that way cause just getting the super from without any effort is well, basically no challenge at all. My opinion on Amy not having ever changed into super form is that she isn't strong enough to posses its power. Everyone else seems to have had the accurate training but even though Amy has been around the block she still is generally weak. Maybe when she's older but it will most likely never happen. |
| Where the hell is Final Fantasy X HD?! | |
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| Captain Olimar | Jun 1 2011, 10:27 AM Post #15 |
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Mushroom Hill Act 2
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If you're right, one day we could see...Super Eggman 
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