~Welcome to the Sonic Blast Community Forum~
Greetings stranger, it is an honor to have you as a visitor. Since we opened in 2006 our goal has been to offer the most authentic Sonic-themed community on the web for Sonic enthusiasts new and old. We do our best to provide the most unique features, best Sonic-themed designs, and have the latest news; always improving to cover all of your Sonic needs. Our community is full of friendly people and we hope you enjoy your brief stay but would be thrilled if you decided to join in on the fun. Being a part of our community is easy, quick, and absolutely free.

Click here to join our community and enter the land of Mobius as a =SB= citizen!
Citizens may log in to their account to participate in our land's conversations and access all of our features:

Username:   Password:
Add Reply
Playstation Move
Topic Started: Mar 10 2010, 05:10 PM (297 Views)
Neo MetallixPosted Image
Member Avatar
~Doomsday Overlord~
Yup, PS3s motion controller is officially called PS Move. Much better than the rumored PS Arc and PS Gem, imo. I watched it live streamed. Now I was never a fan of this, I don't think I'll buy it, but it looks so much better than the Wii. I mean a lot better. Interesting stuff ahead.

Here's the whole press event, watch it for yourself and see what you think.
http://g4tv.com/videos/44675/GDC-2010-Sony-Playstation-GDC-Press-Event/

With a fact sheet:
http://www.psnathome.com/general/playstation-move-official-fact-sheet.html
Edited by Neo Metallix, Mar 10 2010, 06:17 PM.
Posted Image
Posted Image
Posted Image
Puncture the Porcupine, my fancharacter!
Offline Mini Profile
 
Zak
Member Avatar
For The Circle
Yes! Wanted more info on this since E3. I think I liked Arc better, but Move's good to. Can't wait!
"Ati Ramar, In defeat we learn."
Offline Mini Profile
 
Deleted User
Deleted User

I already have an Eye that's been gathering dust for months, so at least I don't have to pay 100$. I'm waiting until it gets more support before I consider buying. Most of the games right now are called things like "Motion Fighter" and "Game Party".
 
Neo MetallixPosted Image
Member Avatar
~Doomsday Overlord~
They are temporary names, Socom 4 looked pretty good with it. I'd buy one just to use it in Socom, but I'll mainly be using my Dualshock in Socom. Motion Fighters still looked pretty good, I like that you can use two instead of being limited to one and it looks much better then that eyetoy virtua fighter on PS2(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uzNJwk9Z4ds). The game I'm most hyped up about for it is Ape Escape, the PS1 game was awesome and I can't wait for the series to return even if it's motion controlled. Some games I just don't know how they would work, how would you use it in Gran Turismo 5? It supports it according to the website.
Edited by Neo Metallix, Mar 14 2010, 01:17 PM.
Posted Image
Posted Image
Posted Image
Puncture the Porcupine, my fancharacter!
Offline Mini Profile
 
Lord English
Member Avatar
Sandopolis Act 2
So basically it works like most proffesional motion capture devices, but only has one ball instead of a couple dozen?
Offline Mini Profile
 
Sonic CD
Member Avatar
*Trouble keeps you runnin' faster*
Ripoff of Natal IMO.

Now Metallix is going to correct me.
Posted Image
^ My favorite game of all time!!
USA Soundtrack > Japanese Soundtrack
Offline Mini Profile
 
Neo MetallixPosted Image
Member Avatar
~Doomsday Overlord~
The Iblis Trigger
Mar 15 2010, 12:51 PM
Ripoff of Natal IMO.

Now Metallix is going to correct me.
Yeah, it's nothing like Natal. It uses controllers. Also Eyetoy from 2003 says hi! You remember that right? The device that Natal takes inspiration from...

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-vs-playstation-move-article?page=1
Quote:
 

It's been less than 24 hours since I attended the PlayStation Move reveal event at GDC, and I'm gathered in a small conference room of game-makers and press for Sony's presentation to developers. I'm looking for answers. Yesterday's event established release date, ballpark pricing and bundling options. I got to play a bunch of games too, but many of them were so early in development that accurately gauging the potential of the controller was a tough call.

The state of much of the software was such that you could be forgiven for thinking Move is little more than a Wii MotionPlus with some fancy camera options. But I know how good Sony's R&D teams are, I've read up on the underlying tech, and with the right concept and execution this should stand alongside the technological innovation found in Project Natal and in terms of certain, crucial applications, it could indeed surpass it.

As for the nuts and bolts of the wand itself, SCEE's David Coombes sets out his stall.

"The controller itself has a bunch of inertial sensors built into it which can be used to detect motion. There's an accelerometer, a gyroscope and a magnetometer in there. Those can be used to determine position and orientation," he says. "However, inertia sensors have some inherent limitations. They tend to suffer from drift and inaccuracy, there's a lot of noise in the data.

"Some of that is because these are simple integrated circuits. These aren't the sensors you'll get in an aeroplane for instance. What we did was add a glowing sphere that the [PlayStation Eye] camera can track, similar to the tech used in motion capture labs."

The combination of internal sensors - talking to the PS3 via a Bluetooth connection - and the PSEye tracking the glowing, bulbous tip of the Move adds to the flexibility and accuracy of the controller.

"The really cool thing about having the illuminated ball is that it works in all kinds of lighting conditions," Coombes continues. "It can work in darkness because it is self-illuminating. You change the colour of the ball and when you have four players, each one can have a differently coloured controller.

"The controllers can change colour too. So they can turn red as you move into a dangerous area, for example, or it can flash when you fire a gun. So as well as the tracking there are some interesting game design options you can use within the controller."

Sony research and development guru Anton Mikhailov takes point on much of the technical data imparted at the briefing. Straight away he's talking about the "dreaded lag". Yesterday, at the main event, latency with Move was defined as being under one frame - a state of affairs that seems almost unbelievable, putting the motion controller on equal footing with the DualShock 3 and Sixaxis. It turns out that getting the lowest possible latency was one of the team's primary objectives.

"The interface itself has some inherent latency because there's processing and so forth," explains Mikhailov. "But also, the player might have latency. If I want to throw a punch, I'm gonna move slower than I would if I were just pressing a button, so it's a two-part thing.

"What people often forget is that latency actually is very important for casual games. People think you can swing around, you can do some gestures and that's OK. Actually for a game to be connected to the player, to feel intuitive, it has to have low latency. Latency creates the barrier between the user and the interface."

Mikhailov then goes into an in-depth briefing on just about all the various PlayStation controllers Sony has been responsible for, from the DualShock to the SingStar mics to EyeToy and Buzz. The latter devices all have limited functionality but they are intuitive and familiar to the casual audience. What Move - and by implication the WiiMote - does is to give the flexibility of the DualShock without the abstraction. No longer do you press X to perform a motion like, say, swinging a bat. You simply use the wand to mimic the action.

"It's like a bridge between casual devices and the DualShock," Mikhailov adds. "Some games are still going to be better on the DualShock. We're not trying to take games away from the DualShock in any way. There are some times when you really need buttons and analogue sticks."

According to Mikhailov, it's all about being intuitive, robust, and being able to work in all conditions.

"One big issue with EyeToy we always tried to tackle was lighting. If you have low-light conditions, you can't see the user and you can't track him very well. That's why the spheres are illuminated: you can work in pitch-black conditions. Second thing: it's robust. It goes back to precision: if the interface isn't precise, the user starts to blame the interface and we don't want that.

"It's also intuitive. It won't lose track of you, even if the camera loses track of the sphere it'll compensate with the accelerometers. I can put the controllers behind my back, I can swing backwards, it's not losing tracking. You don't have to worry about it freaking out... there's a one-to-one connection."

Based on yesterday's presentation and gameplay session, if there was one positive you could take away from the event, it was that Move is clearly a far more precise implementation than the Wiimote. Some of the games felt clearly more "tactile" than the Wii equivalents.

Move also takes care of the basics. When I spoke with Kudo Tsunoda at gamescom last year, I was surprised that you couldn't point with Project Natal. As Anton Mikhailov powers up one of his myriad tech demos, it's clear that Move does pretty much everything a developer or gamer could want from it. Armed with twin wands, he's pointing as you would with a light gun or laser pen.

"Doing a pointer is very easy because you have a 3D object in space," Mikhailov says. "All you do is shoot a ray from where you are to the TV. From a programming perspective your math is very simple, it's like a ray-tracer."

The demo simply shows Atari VCS style rectangular blobs moving around the screen as Mikhailov wields the twin controllers. It's clear to see that while pointing works, the targets are jittering. But this is by design.

"You can see the jitter, but the jitter's in my hand," Mikhailov explains. "I have a tripod here. Check this out. If I stabilise myself on the tripod, I can get rid of the jitter. It's in my hand. It's not system jitter. It's not some kind of noise. If you want to make a really accurate shooting game, you keep the jitter in because you want the players to get better at shooting.

"If you want to make a more casual game, you smooth this out. It introduces latency when you smooth things but for a casual user, maybe that's a better thing. As a developer, you have control of this. If you want to make a hardcore game with precise tracking or if you want to make a more casual game, or give some help to the user you can do that."



Quote:
 
The next part of the demonstration is exceptionally cool. A puppet is created on-screen that is accurately mimicking Mikhailov's movements. By using a combination of inputs from the Move controllers, combined with head-tracking and what must be some level of interpolation, the demo is entering Project Natal territory. Move is seemingly tracking the entire upper body. Um, wow.

"If you want to do the full body tracking like Natal, you can still do this with the camera," Mikhailov says. "It's all very low latency, one-to-one tracking. We had a fighting game on show based on gesture moves [Motion Fighters]. A lot of people don't want to use gesture moves. You don't have to. It's just a game design choice."
Mikhailov's views on full body motion processing as seen in Natal are intriguing and are difficult to argue with. While Microsoft's controller can scan the entire body well, the bottom line is that a hell of a lot of crucial control information comes from our fingers. Factoring them out is a big gamble to take on something as important as a controller.

"Buttons are important. No system right now can track hands reliably," Mikhailov says in pointed reference to Project Natal. "There's just not the resolution in the cameras, there's not the processing in the current chips. Really, it's many years out before you can do awesome full body-tracking.
"You can do something pretty rough with 3D cameras but you just can't do something with this level of precision. If you want a deeper gameplay experience, you're going to need to have this kind of low-level precision. The biggest thing we learned from EyeToy... if you don't have buttons you can do lots of games but they lack depth."
Posted Image
Posted Image
Posted Image
Puncture the Porcupine, my fancharacter!
Offline Mini Profile
 
Zak
Member Avatar
For The Circle
True, the trouble with Eyetoy was the fact that it was hard to track you at times. I hated the Back and Forward buttons on the screen. The fact that the controller has buttons is a lot better.

I also like the globe changing color thing. That's kinda cool too. :)
"Ati Ramar, In defeat we learn."
Offline Mini Profile
 
Neo MetallixPosted Image
Member Avatar
~Doomsday Overlord~
You all remember Kevin Butler from those new Playstation commercials? Well, here's his newest one. I don't think this is going on TV though, but here he is from the Future talking about the PS Move. ;)

Edited by Neo Metallix, Mar 17 2010, 12:29 PM.
Posted Image
Posted Image
Posted Image
Puncture the Porcupine, my fancharacter!
Offline Mini Profile
 
infamousDee
Member Avatar
Flying Battery Act 2
Minus Human
Mar 15 2010, 12:51 PM
Ripoff of Natal IMO.

Now Metallix is going to correct me.
One could just as easily dismiss Natal as a ripoff of Eyetoy - in fact, that would be far more reasonable, since Natal is essentially just an updated version of the latter. I think it's fair to say, though, that both Natal and Move are unashamed ripoffs of the hugely successful Wii Remote.
Offline Mini Profile
 
Neo MetallixPosted Image
Member Avatar
~Doomsday Overlord~
danielwhite74
Mar 18 2010, 11:03 AM
Minus Human
Mar 15 2010, 12:51 PM
Ripoff of Natal IMO.

Now Metallix is going to correct me.
One could just as easily dismiss Natal as a ripoff of Eyetoy - in fact, that would be far more reasonable, since Natal is essentially just an updated version of the latter. I think it's fair to say, though, that both Natal and Move are unashamed ripoffs of the hugely successful Wii Remote.
It's not really a rip off since Sony has had the technology since before the Wii came out. They were experimenting with it, but never brought it out to the public since they did not see it taking off. Now that the Wii has shown it is popular, they have continued the development and decided to bring it out. Seriously there are old videos from 2004 with a demonstration of this same technology for PS2.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_PtoxKDcCXc
Posted Image
Posted Image
Posted Image
Puncture the Porcupine, my fancharacter!
Offline Mini Profile
 
Deleted User
Deleted User

Everyone knowss that the PS3, Wii, and 360 are all ripoffs of the Atari 2600. Can't have more than one games console, people.
 
Lord Vermillion
Member Avatar
Show...Off

Neo Metallix
Mar 17 2010, 12:29 PM
You all remember Kevin Butler from those new Playstation commercials? Well, here's his newest one. I don't think this is going on TV though, but here he is from the Future talking about the PS Move. ;)

HAHAHAHA. My brother showed me this a day or two ago, that was hilarious! XD

My brother was saying Nintendo was bad mouthing Sony about them actually making the Move. Does anyone know exactly what they said?
Posted Image

"It's not the end of the world... But you can see it from here."- Adam Jensen (Deus Ex: Human Revolution)
Offline Mini Profile
 
Neo MetallixPosted Image
Member Avatar
~Doomsday Overlord~
@ Vermillion... Basically the main PR dude for Nintendo America(That Reggie dude) said that they would be embarrassed if they did what Sony is doing, which I don't get because it's basically a more advanced version of their own technology that isn't a simple waggle waggle or point and click. I think they're just worried because the Wii has lost its steam in Japan, is losing its steam in America(outsold by 360 in February), and now there is nothing unique about the Wii because Sony/Microsoft will now have their own motion games. The difference is they have actual games to back it up whereas the Wii pretty much lacks the steady stream of quality games that its competition gets. Don't get me wrong the Wii has many great games, but most of those are 1st party games and they are few and far between.
Edited by Neo Metallix, Mar 19 2010, 01:35 PM.
Posted Image
Posted Image
Posted Image
Puncture the Porcupine, my fancharacter!
Offline Mini Profile
 
Sonic Paradise
Member Avatar
Marble Garden Act 2
Its not on my must have list, but i will consider it
Posted Image
Add me to PSN

Offline Mini Profile
 
1 user reading this topic (1 Guest and 0 Anonymous)
ZetaBoards - Free Forum Hosting
Enjoy forums? Start your own community for free.
Learn More · Register for Free
« Previous Topic · Act II: Video Game Station · Next Topic »
Add Reply